mr-sub-zero | gsans a écrit :
Toujours superbes tes pizzas Sub, rien à dire, c'est nickel.
Tu me cherches avec la TA !!!! Bon tu sais quoi cette semaine je te fais la totale !!! Huuuummm.
Je ferais 2 pâtons en suivants la méthode de Graig a TA et j'ajouterai mon levain en partie, je ferais maturer dans mon garage qui doit être a 18-19° mais surtout ou la T° ne bouge quasiment pas.
Faudra être indulgent les amis ! 
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Merci, ne le prend pas personnellement, c'est que j'en ai un peu marre qu'on dise que c'est super compliqué la TA, personne sur le topic ne va oser tester alors qu'il suffit de bien doser la levure pour un litre d'eau et d'essayer de contrôler un minimum la température, c'est quand même plus gratifiant que le frigo ou tu stagnes et que t'apprends plus rien.
j'attends avec impatience le full monthy alors
DustB a écrit :
Pour le Bestron, moule à manquer, tourtière (un peu petite), mais je suis bloqué sur le thermostat, je ne sais pas quoi en faire.
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Il suffit de temps en temps de faire une recherche en filtrant le sujet pour trouver la réponse!
L'universal à l'air bien mieux, mais c'est pas le même prix ! Le petit compact fonctionne bien mais je ne suis pas convaincu du résultat obtenu par le pétrissage, on est bien loin de la pâte hyper soyeuse du santos, ou alors c'est moi qui m'y prend comme un pied, ce qui est fort possible
Voici quelques quotes de pizzamaking
de Pappy:
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I am particularly intrigued that you favor long room temperature ferments, as I switched to that method for my latest pies after some extensive reading. Lactic acid production is enhanced by warmer temperatures, while the more vinegary acetic acid dominates a cold temperature ferment. Also, there is ample testimony that a room temperature ferment enhances crispiness and lightness of the dough. Evelyne Slomon, for example, testifies to the ethereal lightness of the Totonno crust, and notes that he was the only one of the "elite" pizza makers who stuck with the original same-day dough method, while even Lombardi switched to a slow cold ferment. In Naples, same-day rises are the standard; Marco, a.k.a. pizzanapolitana discusses the importance of enhanced lactic acid production in several of his posts, as does Daniel DiMuzio in his essential Bread Baking: An Artisan's Perspective. DiMuzio is a big fan of long direct method bulk ferments for baguettes, and specifically mentions the crispiness and lightness that result.
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Flavor in dough comes mainly through bacterial fermentation. There are two types of lactic bacteria that produce the acids that flavor dough: homofermentative and heterofermentative. Homofermentative bacteria thrive in temperatures in the 70-95F range, and produce lactic acid, which is mild, and similar to the tangy flavor one gets in yogurt. Heterofermentative bacteria thrive at 50-65F, and produce both lactic and acetic acid, which is sharp, and similar to the flavor one gets in vinegar.
The temperature at which you choose to ferment your dough favors one type of bacterial activity over the other, and leads to different flavors in the dough. I personally do not like sourdough, so I prefer a process that encourages the production of lactic acid and minimizes acetic acid. A long room temperature rise of 5-8 hours gives me the flavor profile I am looking for, which would be impossible with a cold-fermented dough.
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TxCraig1:
there will be meaningful differences even if the balls appear identical in terms of signs of fermentation. SD (dourdough) is a symbiotic culture of both yeast and Lactic Acid Bacteria (LAB). Both contribute to the work of fermentation – there is both yeast and lactic acid fermentation happening. Both produce CO2 which causes the dough to rise, but there is a lot of other stuff going on, and that stuff varies with temperature.
This is horribly oversimplified, but generally speaking, the biochemical processes are different at different temperatures. There are changes in the relationship between the yeast and LAB and their respective metabolisms resulting from differences in the activity level of the respective flora and changes in enzyme activity that affect the sugars present and the competition for those sugars.
Flavor varies with temperature because the acids and other byproducts of fermentation change with temperature. For example, cooler temps favor acetic acid production while warmer temperatures favor lactic acid production. There are dozens of alcohols other than ethanol produced in addition to many aldehydes and other compounds. The ratio of these compounds is also affected by temperature.
I, along with others here, have generally found that the best flavor is typically developed at temperatures around 60-65F.
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Citation :
Pete-zza
On the matter of the respective roles of yeast, bacteria (including lactobacillus), and enzymes, I know that Marco and Jeff have not always been in agreement. From what I can tell, mainly from what Marco and November have said, yeast, bacteria and enzymes perform better at higher temperatures. In fact, according to Marco, if the temperature of fermentation gets down below 5 degrees C, or 41 degrees F, the bacteria slow down and can stop reproducing (see Reply 20 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/i [...] msg11903). Many home refrigerators hover around 41 degrees F. Yet, given enough time, the bacteria will fulfill their tasks and are largely responsible for the flavors in the finished crust because of the formation of the organic acids (lactic, acetic, propionic, etc.), esters, aldehydes and other flavor- and aroma-contributing compounds.
Amylase is an enzyme. It works primarily on damage starch in the flour (usually a milling defect) and helps extract the natural sugars in the starch, which constitutes about 70% of the flour. To help with that extraction, millers (and sometimes bakers) often add additional amylase enzymes to the flours, as by malting. The Caputo 00 flours are unmalted. The grains from which the Caputo flours are milled also seem to be less susceptible to damaged starch compared with our domestic flours. You can usually tell whether a flour has been supplemented with additional amylase enzyme by looking at the falling number (FN). Falling number refers to a test that is performed on flour samples. For a good explanation of that test, see the section “Falling Number” at http://www.cooknaturally.com/detailed/detailed.html. To read more about the amylase aspects of flour, you might want to take a look at this post: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/i [...] l#msg42233 (Reply 1). Note, in particular, the posts linked in the referenced post.
For flours other than low-amylase flours like the Caputo flours, I tend to view them as candidates for both room temperature fermentation and cold fermentation. I have done both, with satisfactory results. So, I don’t see any reason why you can’t use your Five Roses flour in a room-temperature fermentation application. However, if you plan to use a natural starter culture or a preferment, you will want to get the dough formulation properly established so that the dough is ready when you are. As an example of such an exercise, you might take a look at one of my more interesting experiments with a naturally-leavened Lehmann dough, at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/i [...] l#msg12644 (Reply 165).
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Citation :
Pizzabloger:
Wild yeast cultures can be tricky because you are not only dealing with trying to maintain a healthy balance between the wild yeasts (leavening portion) and the lactobacilli, but a culture is capable of producing both acetic acids (more sharp/sour in character) and lactic acids (more "mellow" in character).
There are a lot of tools to help get you to whatever flavor profile you are looking for:
1. Amount of levain/starter added to the formula
2. Maturity, or "age", of the starter when added to the formula
3. The hydration of the starter
4. Fermentation temperatures
5. Length of fermentation
I personally have found that both ambient (room) and cold fermentations can produce pleasing results.
That being said, I agree with Bill with regards to the 65° to 75° range. I typically use about 3.15% of Ischia starter and ferment between 68° and 72° for a total (bulk and proof) all-in time of 26 to 30 hours and I think the flavor of the Ischia really is in the pocket at that point.
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Le but est donc d'utiliser le levain en très petite quantité (50g litre) juste pour faire gonfler la pâte mais pas pour lui donner du gout comme pour le pain, c'est la longue maturation a température ambiante et les organismes présents dans celui-ci qui vont se charger de développer les arômes.
C'est ce qui doit donner le gout unique aux pizzas de chez Da Michelle.
Vidéo: Le Goût du Voyage - à Naples Recette de pizza napolitaine chez Gino Sorbillo |